Discussion of the Day
Neglected or Abandoned spaces
Glenice L 124411315-Jun-24
I've been seeing many videos with vacant, abandoned or neglected buildings across North America and just can't accept the levels of homelessness/under-housed in statistics either. While some governments (local, state or federal) may try to do a few things, do you think neighbours could also be allowed to help clean up some of these spaces?
Or should we simply pay our own taxes, mind our own squares, hide our tools and hearts, and/or turn up our noses at the unkempt potential residences/farming spaces nearby?
I'm aware there are some good souls (lawn care companies) that even help to clean up bad lots in especially America and Australia for free, but these tasks seem so overwhelming to just leave it to the chance of a freebie showing up.
What are your thoughts?
Comments
  • All that's needed is a magic wand, Properties fall into disrepair because of neglect, lack of interest, lack of money and sometimes due to oversights during construction, One problem that 'authorities' have to deal with is legal title and another is assumption of liability where access is provided , Then where does the money come to beautify, repair , restore upgrade and sustain come from?
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    • Some places should be torn down as they are fire hazards.
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      • Unfortunately there are some places that are owned by people who only occupy them for short periods at a time. The rest of the time they are vacant. That is sometimes because they have experienced or heard of unfortunate experiences as landlords, and do not want the hassle of being a landlord. Yes, it is hard to see such places unoccupied when some people are without shelter. There is an old aged care facility near me that is empty and going to ruin because there was asbestos in it, but last I heard nobody had the funds to deal with it. That would be an ideal location to make into group accommodation if someone could spend the money on it. Very sad.
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        • This is a bit too much! No comment. ☺️
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          • Got same thing in Australia. Empty buildings and people sleeping on the streets. I went in Chicago a mission centre that gives homeless people a place to sleep,food,clean clothes and a bath/ shower. It’s a pity the government here don’t give charities money to set up places in vacant office blocks.. the money could supply bed,food etc and a card with money for daytime use but no alcohol or cigarettes.
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            • no comment
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              • I think if more people weren't so afraid of getting in trouble for trespassing they would be more likely to help clean up the neglected property.
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                • I want to rescue them!
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                  • demolish them
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                    • Firstly, these places are owned by someone. Therefore, what happens to them is in their hands. Perhaps they are owned by multiple people who inherited the property and will never agree on what to do with them! Family dynamics can come into play. This happened in my family and my husband's family. Some of the heirs would sign off and others wouldn't. Therefore, several people owned the property. They died off, leaving it to their children until there were so many property owners that there was nothing anyone could do. By then, it was worthless and no one would sell it because it wasn't worth the effort. Secondly, the property owner may have died off without a will which eventually would go to the state. Then it would probably be sold at auction or it could be a property whose taxes are in arrears. Eventually, it will be sold at auction. All of the red tape ties property up sometimes for years while it is deteriorating. Nothing is ever as simple as it should be. In a nation like ours, people shouldn't be homeless. Believe it or not, some people want it that way. Even if they have housing, they won't take care of it or just abandon it. They don't want to be found, have an address, pay taxes, etc. They are content, and that is their choice as insane as it seems to the rest of us. People come in many different mindsets.
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                    • In my city, a club was torn down, and the lot has been vacant for years. Now they are putting up tiny temporary housing for the homeless.
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                      • We must find a way to help homeless people - I feel pretty powerless and being sorry for them is not enough. Any idea what to do with empty buildings? I don’t know any where I live but if there was one I’d help to get in and let people have a roof over them.
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                        • There are a few reasons why buildings are left vacant. Here in Sydney we have Parramatta Gaol. Prisoners were moved to a new gaol years ago with plans to turn the old Gaol into a hotel/motel but because it's heritage listed they refused to knock walls down and decided the cells were too small to be used by paying customers. While I agree the external walls should be left intact I can't see any reason why the internal walls can't be knocked down, not all of them but surely most of them. It's a shocking waste to leave it standing there empty and falling into disrepair. So heritage listing is 1 reason then there's builders and developers going broke. There is a beautiful house in Castle Hill called Dunrath which was built by Francis De Groot who is somewhat notorious. De Groot brought each brick himself to complete the house. It is a beautiful house with magnificent views to the mountains. When the Cherrybrook station was built the owner of Dunrath sold the house to a developer but his development plan was refused on the grounds of heritage so the house was sold again for $42 million to another developer, for what reason we don't know. The second developer builds high rise and every single development built by his company came with problems. One has such serious problems the building will need to be monitored for the entirety of it's life, yet he was allowed to continue building. He was building 4 or 5 towers in Castle Hill when his company went into liquidation, he is overseas and probably won't ever return to Australia but in the meantime the towers stand half way through completion and Dunrath falls into disrepair, so builders and developers going broke is another reason buildings stand empty. Winding up a business seems to take a very long time and I'm always amazed when I drive past the deserted towers to see the cranes still in position that the owners haven't gone and collected them. It must be a legal thing. I don't like the way these things drag on and on, it should all be settled and be done and over with.
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                          • Yes there are many good ideas and should have's, many are excellent and would solve problems. But they are too hard for these idiot politicians who focus on everything else but real human needs and rights. It's a wonder the Chinese aren't snapping up the properties
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                            • There is a movement here in Australia pushing for neglected, abandoned places to be opened up to help people who need a roof over their heads. Citizens doing what politicians should be doing.
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                              • It’s all about money, either you have to much, or not enough, but that depends on what your social status is that DICTATES, your station
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                                • I too despair,at the waste of vacant abandoned properties, in Australia we have many families on low incomes, who along with the homeless simply can't afford the skyrocketing rents. How can millions of taxpayer dollars, go to entertainment and sports,and yet our Housing, health, and Defense are are being woefully underfunded ???👎
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                                  • I like your first statement Sounds good
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                                    • I am hoping the State government applies the same land tax to their vacant houses sitting idle that they are doing to current landowners which are forcing them to sell because of the costs and not being able to put up the rents to cover it.
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                                      • It should e used for homeless people so they can live just like others.
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                                        • people as a community need to learn how to live within society and a community without prejudice
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                                          • Vote Conservative in Canada and Republican in the next election. Stop this destruction!
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                                            • I'm not convinced that mere voting can suddenly change what has been going on for decades. Many of these abandoned spaces have been experienced by Conservative and Republicans/Democratic govt. The WILL of any nation matters far more that political quests for power to lawd over others and likely to again ignore potentially livable spaces.
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                                          • 1 Shame to see buildings/houses sitting vacant for years.
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                                            • I agree that there is to many houses left vacant, and there’s so many homeless people, what are the government doing in this situation, nothing.
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                                              • There is a house around the corner from us that has been empty for years, it is always kept need and tidy and it makes me so cranky because someone could be living in it. There are also a lot of empty housing department houses and units which is just ridiculous seeing the waiting list is supposedly so long.
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                                                • Not so many buildings empty, but lots of empty retail spaces here and there
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                                                  • We have developed for our selves a crazy litigious society. Somebody is always looking for a way to make a quick buck so they try and get a silly lawsuit going. On the other hand there are those that just can't wait to report any behaviour to the local police. Trouble, trouble, trouble and more trouble. Somebody owns these properties and they are completely responsible for maintaining them. I guess if you're well off enough the rules don't apply to you.
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                                                    • In some cases, the owners/residents are in fact living/abiding there, but aged, injured, recuperating, financially stressed and have no one else to visit with them nor to help with landscaping chores. Sometimes not even neighbours know there's a sick/weak person inside, or that their neighbour has died long ago. In any event, if these spaces are not being financially speculated on, then they're literally being wasted. Over time, the technology or systems used in most houses go bad or need upgrading. Then there are the threats of malfunctions, fires, floods, collapsing roofs/floors, graffiti, illegal occupants, vandalism etc. And just how can any town/city budget be met if no taxes are being collected from so many of these properties? There are just so many things to consider when addressing these spaces so I really hope our societies (leaders and common folks) can revision how we acquire, use and maintain spaces continually.
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                                                    • Shawn B 1061185Glenice L 1244113
                                                      Hi, You have a tremendous insight in to the problem. The world needs more people like you that can look at problems with a caring and compassionate eye. That's pretty much the only way we, as a society, will ever conquer the problems we face.
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                                                  • We should all try to keep it so that the homeless can stay for while until they find a real place to live.
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                                                    • I don't personally come across abandoned direlect homes or factories where I come from.
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                                                      • The buildings have a use by date communities move on demographic changes industry dies it is a shame but these things happen Cheers Glenice Robert
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                                                        • If everyone just took care of their own it would help
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                                                          • Difficult to justify the cost of someone else is benefitting in today's economy
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                                                            • It's the same here in Australia too. There is a closed down school near us with a house all boarded up. Yet there are people screaming out for some where to live, homelessness has gone through the roof. It's just a waste and because no one is using the school it is going down hill at a great rate of knots. There's even a tennis court, why couldn't some government department turn the old school into some accommodation for the needy even if it is only a temporary fix. At least it would be being used again instead of rotting away before our eyes. The owners of any run down building or premises should be made to clean them up. My parents had a vacant block in Brisbane and Dad used to get letters from the council to clean it up and people used to dump stuff on it. I remember helping them clean it up and I fell over some tyres that some body had dumped there. They ended up selling the land because they received a good offer on it and it then saved them from having to maintain it too. So where is the fairness letting other people get away with not maintaining their properties? I guess letters don't get passed on to the owners but after a certain amount of time has lapsed surely there is more they can do.
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                                                              • We had a church across the street abandoned for years . The homeless started getting in through a back window and living in it . As soon as someone noticed the cops came and threw everyone out and for a week after we're tackling people on the grass if they tried to get in. I just thought was so ironic that an empty church won't allow the homeless to sleep there! What other purpose could a church serve but at least shelter the homeless!
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                                                              • Jenny L 591463Izabelle 1457992
                                                                I agree, how bizarre. I thought a church would welcome any one with open arms. I can understand people can do more damage than should happen but why couldn't they open the doors for them. There was an old abandon wool shed in Sydney and it was turned into a drug and homeless hangout and eventually maybe the owners, who knows burned it down. What a waste of a historic building. Very sad.
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                                                            • The community should all get together to help clean it up if the government would allow it.
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                                                              • all over the world has the same problem governments dont want to spend the money to fix them
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                                                                • I don't know about the USA but the same situation exists across Australia and in many cases many of the houses, flats apartments etc. are lying empty and neglected by the very system which should be taking action, namely Government Agencies! Housing Trusts, Commissions etc.! Our Governments wring their hands and, for purely political reasons, to a woman and man, being the self-interested hypocrites all are loudly proclaim how concerned they are about the lack of housing, the homelessness which has become a scandal of monumental levels in Australia. At the same rime they refuse to provide their own agencies with the money to renovate and repair the Tens of Thousands of flats, apartments, houses which these governments own. They would rather squander untold hundreds of billions on Space Programs, Military Armaments to allegedly defend us against some, as yet un-named enemy, armaments all of which will have become obsolete decades before any of it is actually operational! Then, of course these parasites set aside endless amounts of money so that they can travel to the fleshpots of the world to attend Conferences which in the end achieve Nothing! Conferences which could just as easily be conducted on-line at minimal cost. All these parasites are interested in is themselves and to getting, or holding on to, Power and the money they get paid to sit around doing little and, most certainly, no Real Work.
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                                                                  • Abandoned buildings are a problem everywhere it seems and unless local councils, we have those here in Australia come to the party and force owners to clean them up and make them available nothing will be done. In some instances, though council rates not being paid means that councils have the ability to claim them as payment and should also be trying to help out with homelessness by refurbishing and making them available for those who need them. There are businesses too who could come to the party but a lack of motivation and off course money to spare to do it might be the problem but time will tell if enough voices are heard in favour off fixing up these places it could happen
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                                                                    • The family kids should something about its. This is our job.
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                                                                      • I agree. All these abandoned houses and business’ could be put to use to help people out especially with these tough times we are living in making it hard for everyone. Where I live there are just so many houses and businesses not in use and a left there all run down yet there are people and families with no place to go. Sometimes the government and business’ should wake up a bit and not run the country to suit themselves but give someone else a fair go and lend a hand.
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                                                                        • It's only going to get worse as social media continues to rot brains and forster entiltlement.
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                                                                          • Homelessness is a huge problem and so is abandoned buildings. Government needs to do something.
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                                                                            • abandoned houses + homeless, = solution it seems a no brainer to me
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                                                                              • who pays the taxes
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                                                                                • I agree that these abandoned buildings should be refurbished and made available to the homeless. It would be a great project for a billionaire
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                                                                                  • those that own the abandon spaces/building should either demolish or repair then sell or rent to someone who will use it. the empty lots need to be kept clean so as not to cause fire hazard
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                                                                                    • like Australia,corporate companies look after their own and really dont care about the rest of us.USA republicans were similar to the LNP and didnt give a stuff....many US citizens are suffering the same as we are,BUT in USA residents just walked away....such a tragedy
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                                                                                      • I feel large corporations like to create the homelessness through workplace injury and such, to suppress the manual labourers and keep wages down.
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                                                                                        • Councils could cleanup and charge owner, there not hard to spot and they do have the rate payers name and details.
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                                                                                          • Get one of the fixer upper tv shows to come in and renovate. They could televise the events and put the funds towards community clean ups. Just a thought.
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                                                                                            • There will always be the small group of good people willing to help out others but sadly this doesn't extend to govt depts as they get tied up in rules and red tape. Where are all the billionaires and their charitable money as I'm pretty sure homelessness could be eradicated if they put their mind to it. Govt depts/ local govt don't want to get involved or take ownership of problems like this. They would rather see someone burn the place down than spend money on it making it habitable for the homeless or spending money to demolish the building.
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                                                                                              • This underscores the point: the WILL of minds and hearts are far stronger and useful than the MONEY from gazillionnaires
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                                                                                            • ? I don't know enough. It just doesn't make sense why there is so much complaint about never being enough houses and so many more need to be built when there are still so many empty ones. I'll agree with Colin it's because of fake money.
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                                                                                              • I have been watching a channel called The Blessing Boys which goes around and cleans up properties it's wicked what they do, and there are several others that do the same thing, but the fact that most of these properties are empty tells a sad story, I am sure with the stroke of a pen these empty buildings could house families at least short term with not too much effort, i believe the want for help has to outway the need for help the governments need to want to help not just talk, we have loads of empty buildings in our area where the homeless are sleeping outside all someone has to do is open the door, i know its not that easy but its a beginning
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                                                                                                • Yes, I too watch The Blessing Boys; they're as phenomenal as SB Mowing, Juggernaut, Al Bladez and Wills Mowing. Yet the tasks they undertake is so very very rare, given the scale of what exists. I also think its a scream for societal help (Work- to be able to occupy a house/building, Less Drugs- to help reverse the process and get people back into functional roles, Education- without prejudice so we can all see and channel funds into the correct areas with proper oversight. Finally, we need to just "own it"- our systems worldwide need to shift some of the focus from wealth to wholistic health and basic prosperity.
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                                                                                                • boy blunderGlenice L 1244113
                                                                                                  yes well said 100 percent agree
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                                                                                              • Most of what you are seeing are not abandoned they are repossessed by the banks and it is the banks who have allowed them to run down as there is no return to the banks to maintain them. There was a thing called The Global Financial Crisis a couple of years ago which the LNP do not want to accept except when it suits their arguments and all those houses repossessed can not be sold as there are no takers for them and if people maintain them there is a thing known as Squatters Rights that come into play where the bank would loose it all so they prefer to demolish than to maintain. The remainder are in flood zones which had been badly flooded and the owners do not want to even spend the money to demolish them as it costs so much and as no one can live in them all that happens is people come along and strip whatever they can get some money for from them and they become even worse than what they where.
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                                                                                                • Governments all around the world are derelict in their actions. They control everything we do. Two wars going on savagely wanting to win. We need peace and only Government can do that. As for the homeless the Government are happy to leave that to charities but a lot of these people became "homeless" through no fault of their own. There is a great divide between the filthy rich and the strugglers. These derelict empty houses are all over the world.
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                                                                                                  • If it's not actually dangerous (about to fall down, causing rat infestation, etc.), there's nothing the city council can legally do - it's not their property. There are ridiculous ideas like "empty house tax" to make owners pay even more, but that simply yet another greedy government money grab. Some are left empty because it's simply easier than renting it out. With ever-increasing land prices, eventually it will be sold to a developer, who will knock down the existing building(s) and put up multi-housing complex, with city council permission and no regard to the fact that the services cannot handle the number of people already living around the area. Often to save space for another house, they do not have any parking options, so anyone buying there will park on the road, clogging it up, and with the push towards silly electric cars, that makes it very difficult to recharge them. All in all, the empty house is probably the far better choice for the neighbourhood (at least it's quiet, unless drug addled squatters break in, in which case it's time for the police).
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                                                                                                    • View all 4 replies
                                                                                                    • Is it so complicated that the "space" couldn't become re-visualized as a parking lot with EV chargers, Community garden- food and or ornamental plants, naturalized green space? Just wondering.
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                                                                                                    • Andrew C 287196Glenice L 1244113
                                                                                                      All of those would still need the owner's permission and potentially some expense to them. It's easier and cheaper for the owner simply to hold on to the land (whether or not there is a building there) and then sell it years later for a huge profit to a developer - it's called "land banking" or similar terms. Usually they aren't paying a mortgage, so their only outgoing expense would be annual city land taxes.
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                                                                                                    • Glenice L 1244113Andrew C 287196
                                                                                                      (Land-Banking)-That's also very interesting. Some of these spaces were neglected for 10-30+ yrs. Nature is swallowing many of them. So it's almost crazy/risky to be paying taxes for many years with the hopes of making a big $ale. By the way, couldn't some of these owners be ailing or dead over that 10-30 yr period. Further, it seems like our poorer upcoming generation may not be able to afford such assets....what a tangled web we weave! There's a Vacant Unit Tax in Ottawa,Canada that has generated far more money than the city/Municipal govt. expected and literally forcing owners to become landlords instead of just property owners. The city hauled in over $11M when they'd expected about $6M for 2023. Owners/residents are required to complete the VUT form each year but there are few exemptions.
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                                                                                                    • Andrew C 287196Glenice L 1244113
                                                                                                      Unless the land is somewhere that can be badly damaged (e.g. a cliff top area that crumbles into the sea), there is very little risk - land values will always go up. If the current owner dies, then it will be their family who inherit the ownership as part of the dead person's estate, then it becomes their choice whether to keep it, fix it up, or sell it. Realistically, people shouldn't even be allowed to own more than the one home they live in (any needed rental houses should be run by the government and truly non-profit organisations). More than that is just being greedy at someone else's expense and is one cause of house prices rapidly going up. 😟
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                                                                                                  • if premises/land is abandoned and been allowed to become derelict/overgrown surely the council can step in and advise clean up, repair or sell.
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                                                                                                    • If the home is abandoned then why isn't the local council finding out where the owner of the home is and why it isn't up to standard. They must know who owned it as they would have paid council rates. It is such a waste for them to be abandoned.
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                                                                                                      • The goverment should do more to get houses for the homeless and they should also let people help to clean up andhave the places looking good for people to live in
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                                                                                                        • How sad that we leave our abandoned spaces to rot when they could be used to create a beautiful space, home and/or community center.
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                                                                                                          • It is up to the government to house. the homeless but at the same time we should be allowed to help. Here in Australia we have a major problem! We live in an affluent area and are now seeing the elderly having to sleep in cars and bus stops because of our housing shortage and the huge rentals because of the shortage of affordable housing .
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                                                                                                            • Free help is great help for people, even those who are doing that good deed need help. I helped a family elderly couple clean their garage, they offered me a cup lemon tea which was greatly made by the lady, I had two cups of tea, that was more than I expected
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                                                                                                              • I live in South Australia. We have a lot of rental homes owned by our State Govt. I personally know of some that have not been rented out for some time. They have long grass which was very dry in Summer that then had grown to 1/2 way up in height of standard windows. 2 of them previously had beautiful gardens - manicured lawns and rows of exquisite roses. None of that is visible at all. I almost cried when we went past there. I'm glad somebody had warned me. It also needs a fresh coat of paint. Apart from that I can't see why It hasn't been rented out again. I know they are probably planning on demolishing, subdividing and building more houses on them. Why didn't they rent them out until they are ready to re-use the land. For the grass to be that high I'm sure they've been empty for some time..............A few others may have been abandoned because people could not pay their rates & taxes or the could be deceased estates - possibly a dispute or next-of-kin can't be located.
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                                                                                                                • G’day Rosemary , same here in Melbourne … :(
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                                                                                                                • It all boils down to money and minimum rental standards. Social housing costs the government a fair bit of our taxes (I’m sure they could allocate spending better, but that’s another story) and if a property cannot meet minimum rental standards they cannot put people in it. A leaky roof causing mould issues can costs tens of thousands to repair, and there are many older properties with all sorts of issues that cost big dollars and they just don’t allocate enough funds to social housing to cover it. A lot of people in social housing are just happy to have a roof over their heads, but it needs to be safe for them. And there are also people already in social housing that need their properties maintained to those minimum standards as well.
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                                                                                                              • it's all over usa in blue state, crazy and something needs to change
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                                                                                                                • Oops! It's seen in about every US state...and a feature in almost every country.
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                                                                                                                • pam raeGlenice L 1244113
                                                                                                                  YES SEEMS TO BE BUT MORE IN BLUE STATES HOW I SEE IT.. HAVE A GOOD TIME..
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                                                                                                              • I love that I'm one of Jehovah's Witnesses! Although numbered over 8,000,000 and growing rapidly, we still aren't able to help everyone in the world, but we do go in after natural disasters and rebuild and repair as much as we can, not only our own sisters and brothers homes, and our Kingdom Halls, but also the neighbors! And, not only build, but supply them with food, water, and other needed supplies. I'm proud of what our organization does! ;-D
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                                                                                                                • In CA the gov't spent billions on homeless problems and nothing has changed.
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                                                                                                                  • I have asked these same questions myself. These homes should be refurbished and turned into low income homes or homeless shelters. If someone owns them and they are not maintaining their homes to a certain standard . Safety concerns like fire hazard , shelters for pests, bringing the value down in the neighbourhood and they are abandoned ,the government should expropriate them for low cost housing or shelters.
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                                                                                                                    • Try to fix and make inside fixtures are working. Have landowners fix them up if can. Unfortunaley peoples property values drop when there is empty boarded up houses.
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                                                                                                                      • Our local homeless never touched them but the illegals have no problem moving right in and making it a home. To be specific I am talking about semi abandoned property with no running water or electricity.
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                                                                                                                        • The government can't just take someone's property and give it to someone else. Also homes don't cure homelessness, look at cities that give money to people and they can do drugs freely on the street, why would you want to pay bills if you can do that.
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                                                                                                                          • It is a problem as the properties are usually privately owned and if they pay their land taxes (rates here in Australia) not much can be done. Same thing with hoarders who have rubbish piling up with rats and other vermin taking hold and strong stench emanating from the property. If people are living in them and they are elderly then yes help them of course as that would be charitable. I guess if the properties are not improved or have shown to be abandoned for so many years then the councils or governments should step in. I think it can be a very fine line to walk.
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                                                                                                                            • If there is a building there, safeguard it, and fix it! There is a need for housing and for buildings. If the site is not safe and needs to be torn down, then create something in the space to make it visually pleasing or useful! If it is owned and the owner can't afford to do anything, then they can sell it off, possibly to the government and it can be upgraded to space that is of use!
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                                                                                                                              • Mind our own business. Selling cheap of giving it to homeless will end up having a half ass restoration, then somebody gets hurt, then it's law suits all over....
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                                                                                                                              • TO EACH HIS OWN
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                                                                                                                                • I do think more of our tax dollars could be used to fix these properties for the homeless instead of leavening them for people to make drug houses out of them.
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                                                                                                                                  • Capitalism is based on profits over people.... what did you expect to happen in the LONG RUN....when it comes to 'capitalism' - Do you expect 'capitalism' to develop a CONSCIENCE....REALLY
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                                                                                                                                    • There's only so much the average person can do. what's needed is for wealthy people, with influence and connections as well as money (not to mention a social conscience) to get involved, as there are so many abandoned houses and apartments that'll need to be worked on and renovated to make them fit for people to live in again. With all the organizations out there for worthy causes, that have ads on TV and online, there should be the same thing for speaking out about all these abandoned buildings, to make the right people more aware. A video showing these buildings, then homeless people, to emphasize what a waste it is and how something should be done, might be effective. And I'm sorry if I got a bit carried away; I'll shut up now.
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                                                                                                                                      • Land owners are not seeing a reasonable return on their assets so they are leaving properties vacant. There needs to be incentives made to private capital to promote occupancy and make it worthwhile for reinvesting in vacant properties. At the same time standards must be maintained by landlords of premises. in short no slum lords to be allowed.
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                                                                                                                                        • It's the same here in Australia, the housing problem is huge but the government can send heaps of money to warring countries and leave Australians living on the street.
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