Discussion of the Day
Basic Income
202502-Nov-21
Have you heard of Universal basic income, or UBI?It's a unconditional form of income that could be provided by your National Government, regardless of income status, or whether you work or not.A recent survey in Australia in indicated there is a Majority support for this!
Some other nations have looked into this as well.
A few nations have even had trials of a UBI.
When Covid19, hit around the world last year, many people lost jobs.
We have more insecure work these days.
Some economists believe rich countries could afford to implement a basic income.
What do you think?
Would you like to see it happen in your nation?
Comments
  • Hi John, I didn't know. Thanks for the fact. It looks like I will have to read more to keep informed.
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    • Never heard of it. Doesn't sound like it would work to me. Country already too much in debt.
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      • i understand denmark has this
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        • It will never happen to USA. To many people enjoy their own way of living.
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          • Hi Diane In fact Alaska, a very red American state, has a dividend paid to every one by big Oil annually. This is a form of UBI so it is possible in the USA
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        • its utopia
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          • I'm not sure that I would have confidence in the present government introducing anything - certainly nothing like this. I do think this proposal is a touch far-fetched and if the government want to do anything they might look at labour hire companies and the exploitation of people who work for a living.
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            • Basic income does not sound right
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              • Rediculous !! I can imagine the increase in "dole "bludgers so people lost jobs during "covid period" there were plenty of job vacancies to be able to get another job .If I were unemployed I would do any job with pride
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                • I think it was Norway that tired this and found to their horror that it was unsustainable, would send the nation broke and was a form of Shangri-La. It rewarded people who wanted to put their feet up and glide while others paid their way for them. The only good part of the story for me was that it was a Socialist Government that introduced it and the very same government that decided it was unaffordable. Some people did benefit from it but others did very well while doing nothing. No matter what you introduce there are always those who misuse or abuse it. Frankly I feel people should be encouraged to work harder and keep more of the money they earn and stop the good old hand out. The bible says if you don't work you don't eat. Even the poor had to work for the free food they were given by collecting it.
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                  • It seems most people are happier when they aren't slaving away with very little free time. Most, not all. I would assume a UBI wouldn't be a sign of the world ending, more so people still working but less hours/days per week. Technology is already taking jobs and it won't get any better. It's quite the conundrum. If I could get by fine working 3-4 days per week and having some money left over to invest, have the odd holiday etc I'd be pretty happy with that. The whole financial world is a mess though and it's clear not many people trust policy makers so I can't blame anyone being very cautious about a UBI.
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                    • I honestly don't think everyone should be paid. I know a few people that think they should just get paid sitting on their couch. Able to work, they just want to get money so they can do their stupid stuff. I call them "Lowlife Crackhead". They get money and spend it on that. Instead of buying their kids something to eat. I'm sorry, I think kids come before anything.
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                      • I think vold years tax. We all be better off. A man said on radio phone said once evenone pay 10% buy abd sell. Evenone will be equal and better off. But this will not happen how else will the working class pay more tax.
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                        • well done beverley s,i am a pensioner and i still work and pay taxes
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                          • Pay everyone without them working for the money - definitely not!! I am an aged pensioner and I am currently doing 4 voluntary jobs in my community to give back for what is given to me.
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                            • I thought it was called Newstart. I don't think all people should be paid. There are some real spongers in society. I don't mean all unemployed. A lot of older unemployed can't find work because of their age. Yes, there is discrimination. Also, people in more physical employment should be able to retire younger than those doing sedentary work. There is an obscene difference in wages allowing some people, I won't mention the Palmers of the world, who are able to play with the courts just for fun and because they have the money to do so. So even if a basic income isn't introduced. the playing field should be evened up so people on low incomes can "play" with the courts too. Maybe legal fees for the rank and file should be capped at .10c.
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                              • Sounds a bit like too good to be true! Or else like the original communist idea - what about the ideal in our society that you get paid for the work you do - not if you just happen to be around and not trying to work.
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                                • It is the death-warrant for freedom. Don't fall for it. Populations would be totally indebted to the Govt for EVERYTHING! Not a good plan. It's the elixir to lull you to sleep.
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                                  • I agree Phyrephly.It is much more rewarding to work,Budget the money earned & enjoy what you save for whatever !!
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                                • Sounds good in principle, can't see it happening.
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                                  • sounds like an excellent reason to bludge on the dole;i have worked for 68 years without dole money
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                                    • I doubt it will ever happen here but it's a great idea. Anything that will lift people out of poverty is good however there are too many greedy corporations and rich people to make it work effectively.
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                                      • We already have a minimum wage which is in the poverty levels same as our pensions. Very low incomes. If all the countries are in on this I would question it seriously. The people never win
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                                        • I've never heard of this and can't see it happening any time soon.
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                                          • Not heard of this. Sounds like the old fashioned Unemployment Benefits from yesteryear.
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                                            • Sorry haven't heard about it.
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                                              • We live a pretty simple uncomplicated life. Money isn't every thing and the more people realise this the better off we all will be. Would be nice if the banks left interest rates alone. The RBA have dug themselves into a corner, can't go up and no room to go down. They can't stop what will happen now. In the UK you get a pension no matter how much money you have, you are automatically eligible. Wish Australia followed suit. Some of us rely on a pension, that's our only income. Now on the surveys the lowest they think we should be earning is $30'000. Pension no where near that I can assure you. We live day to day just hoping things will improve.
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                                                • During times of crisis yes, but in normal circumstances no because it may discourage people from working. Work provides more than just monetary benefits - teaches the value of money (very important), value of time (appreciation of holidays), keeps your mind sharp, keeps you physically fitter in some cases, helps you build character, be disciplined, helps you achieve your goals, helps you become more business savvy, helps you be innovative and creative, helps the economy. Just a few examples ;) Maybe if robots take all the jobs then this system may work.
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                                                  • exactly, Christina C! that's part of exactly what they want, to take from people. Our health, our mentality, our safety, our freedom - gone!
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                                                • The lefties/commos want us all to be poor. Don't fall for this garbage. Ask the millions of people who left Europe
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                                                  • No comment as someone might ask me again if I have spots or something else in my eyes
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                                                    • It certainly would even the field but the most important question would be how do we pay for this. We really can't afford debt for our next generation as there are plenty of other issues they will be facing. It is a good idea though and I think rich countries should at least try and see how it would work.
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                                                      • My income is pretty basic...
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                                                        • You need to work and you want more money try to do overtime
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                                                          • I don't know what UBI means.
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                                                            • yes,i think it should be,I work but i also volunteer with the salvation army,i noticed that when the unemployed were given double the benefit when the virus hit,they ate better,could get nicer clothes,have medication etc,now that its gone im seeing their conditions worsen no end,they say we have very low unemployment but with all government statistics,they are bent to suit whatever story they want to tell.
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                                                              • The Basic income is a more complex thing I think. The key words are "NO JOBS" and "It IS NOT DEPLORABLE TO BE OR PRETEND TO BE POOR". Easy as to understand "No Jobs - Be Poor." However this is no news to some as they have since long ago preferred rather be Poor than Working.
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                                                                • Don't forget the minimum wage is calculated on wages received from the very low to the very high. Nothing is mid stream where most people live. If someone gets 5 million a year in wages and another gets less than 20,000 how can they balance that out to a fair minimum wage.
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                                                                • Igor ALinda C
                                                                  Medical surgery then....to make every one equal.
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                                                                • And some are the working poor.
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                                                                • Igor AChristine M 323842
                                                                  Ok. if we make everyone equal, then it will be equal achieve or not achieve, to work or not to work etc......You will still be equal.
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                                                              • Interesting concept. I will have to research this further.
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                                                                • Of course this is the way. We are transitioning into a different economy . Their is a need for retraining. There is a disparity in the division of wealth which has to be addressed. This can be funded by a number of ways too complex for discussion here. Listen to Andrew Yangs' ideas and bring back JMK.
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                                                                  • to work in a fulfilling job brings its own rewards
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                                                                    • I still think that people need to work in order to retain their sense of dignity, purpose and pride. I think a "top-up" system is okay, as long as you still need to work. Getting money for doing nothing does not help people.
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                                                                      • We have it….it’s called universal super and you have to be very experienced to get it…..lol
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                                                                        • Never heard of this, but I will look into it.
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                                                                          • I'm sure it will become necessary in the future, there just won't be enough full time jobs for everyone who wants one.
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                                                                            • No comment
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                                                                              • UBI is more than the dole. It's more similar to the furlough scheme many countries implemented during COVID lock downs. It's clearly doable with a more responsible system of taxation. Jocinda, NZ PM, has suggested it. This would means benefits being increased by as much as 25% and many low paid workers receiving wage top ups or an increased minimum wage. This is highly unlikely to happen, but there is no reason why it couldn't. It just needs a change in attitude. But as we're seeing with the current COP summit on the environment, changing attitudes to improve the status of people and the state of the planet, this can often seem impossible.
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                                                                                • i would have to look it into it more the way it is now with people sick and laid off it is something to think about i do not believe it would work here because of the tax system and the way things work. If we all pull together and help each other as in the time of world war two after the war people helping one another without charging them favors. People talking and obeying the law and just being good to one another is the only way to make life better, In this it is the only ways. Havng a new world order did not work but being what our anscestors who came here wanted for their children in all the freedoms and the dignity that goes with it is the best way to be
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                                                                                  • Have you ever thought that this is another way to control us. It's part of the New World Order. Nearly all lefties promote it, even Prince Charles is in favour of the it. It won't work, no more than socialism or communism worked.
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                                                                                    • I think its better for people to work for their income but sometimes it helps to have extra help like with covid 19 I get more money now on the carers pension than when I was working
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                                                                                      • Unfortunately the majority of people want to be rich and to hell with people that matter how do you change their attitudes
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                                                                                        • I do not see this as necessary more people would suffer especially the poor. It is clear the well off / rich would do very nicely
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                                                                                          • I believe it will encourage many people (we all know at least one) not to bother getting a job.
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                                                                                            • I am only like of pay day to day.
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                                                                                              • I would like to know how much it paid- and would like if it was more than i get at the moment. I am on a benefit for being a Carer for my husband. Around $260 dollars a week.
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                                                                                                • Providing everyone with a Universal Basic Income is something I strongly believe should happen. It would help get rid of poverty overnight. Also, it could mean that we could lower the minimum wage which would significantly assist small businesses. With a UBI there would be no need for welfare payments such as the unemployment benefit, and payments to other beneficiaries such as the DPB etc. It would also mean there was no need for National Superannuation. Proving those payments costs quite a lot of money not only in the payments themselves but in administering them. Yes, we definitely need a UBI.
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                                                                                                  • I actually think for New Zealand the minimum wage is too high, it hurts small business and drives the cost of everything up.
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                                                                                                    • It could be worth a try. But how is it any different to the system a lot of countries have now of social welfare? Having more money towards healthcare would be invaluable at this point in my life. I am in my late 40's and have a few things going on. It would really help, but at the way things are now I am grateful for anything.
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                                                                                                      • Many people squander their money on things that are not necessary and in the end they are forgotten. Many are teaching their children to do the same. My parents were not wasteful and even the basic wage they can live on.
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                                                                                                        • Sounds good, but there are lots of details to know. With lots of people are loosing their jobs left, right and center because of covid,. household income have decreased 80%. and that's a reality fact, even with government financial help, does not even cover basic household items. Forget about socialism or communism sh..t. . forget about far right wing or far left , or middle standing politics. people's livelyhood are sinking, if they can't see that, then they have no human love in their heart. The study was conducted by TV1 News (NZ) 2weeks ago showed food prices at the supermarket have risen about 10 to 15 % Things you normally buy for $100, now will cost you $150 plus. And to me That is daylight robbery day
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                                                                                                          • genteel poverty. no thanks
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                                                                                                            • I STILL HAVE ENOUGH TO ENJOY THE FINER THINGS IN LIFE
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                                                                                                              • It’s absolutely the right thing to do no one deserves to live in poverty or in the streets because of bad luck and that’s all it is no way - as people on here will likely say- to do with character or laziness or any other excuses. No one asks to be born into their situation. Lus with the fact that there just won’t be any jobs in the future its the only way.
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                                                                                                                • Yep but what about the pensioners?
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                                                                                                                  • It will mean everyone will be provided to everyone will get enough past whatever they currently earn from any means at least that’s what it should be.
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                                                                                                                • No it is not something I would like to see happen. If the Government have that much excess money then perhaps provide more to the Aged Pension I am sure they are much more deserving they have paid their taxes over the years with very little in return when they retire.
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                                                                                                                  • Everyone deserves it young or old to not live in poverty
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                                                                                                                  • You do realise that you don’t have to have worked all your life to receive an age pension? I know people who have never participated in the paid workforce in their lives who receive the age pension. How is that fair?
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                                                                                                                  • Sheree TChristine M 323842
                                                                                                                    A Thank you Christine I actually didn't think of it as I have not come across anybody that has never worked in their lives. I have just mentioned in a comment to Doreen that there are a lot of variables it makes it very difficult.
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                                                                                                                  • Yes Sheree it is very complex. At this point in time the only way to be secure in retirement is to provide for it yourself throughout your working life. This raises other issues for people with disabilities who have been unable to work, for women who often have to spend time out of the workforce due to child rearing obligations, single parents who due to marriage breakdown lose assets and often have to juggle several low paying part time jobs in order to parent and pay the bills etc.
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                                                                                                                  • Sheree TChristine M 323842
                                                                                                                    Thank you Christine I appreciate views very much it gives me a better understanding.
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                                                                                                                • We should be getting paid basic wage rates for the surveys we do. We are being exploited. Companies are taking our opinions and creative ideas and only giving a pittance in return. Many times you have to argue to get even that with some companies. It would not be cost effective to give everyone a Basic wage for nothing. Mankind thrives on productive work and this ensures a high self esteem usually. The country benefits as well. Stop the wasteful handouts Look after the vulnerable. but expect others to carry some of the weight. That is only fair. I remember a time when everyone in Australia was given an Old Age pension after 70 years old regardless of income. This was soon stopped because the country could not even afford that. Socialism is not the panacea for all our problems. Taking money from the Government creates a docile and malleable population and turns citizens into dependents. Bread and circuses revisited. Sop for the Masses..
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                                                                                                                  • No nation could afford to do this. Would not help, anyway. People that use their money incorrectly, would still do so. Not pay their rent, utilities, etc. It would create a lot of wasteful spending.
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                                                                                                                    • What garbage but if that’s the case then those who believe the garbage of it being communism it doesn’t wash. People can still choose to do more. But those who don’t need it won’t get it. It everyone else who even working who are on such low wages they can’t get ends to meet while billionaires squander their money on space flights
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                                                                                                                    • Rhonda D 522615LEANNE B 221779
                                                                                                                      My point is a lot of people do not pay their bills first, but spend it on what they want. They do not care about their bills, only what they want.
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                                                                                                                    • Christine M 323842Rhonda D 522615
                                                                                                                      And a lot of people are homeless because they can’t access the basic human right of having a roof over their head. How many people do you PERSONALLY know of, that are spending all their income support payments on caviar and staffing their personal jets?
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                                                                                                                    • Rhonda D 522615Christine M 323842
                                                                                                                      It happens more often than you would like to admit. People getting evicted from their homes because they misuse their money. Alcohol, cigarettes, nails, hair extensions, etc.are not cheap.
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                                                                                                                    • Christine M 323842Rhonda D 522615
                                                                                                                      People get evicted from their homes because the rent is more than their income support income. Did you know that? The median average rent for a house in Melbourne is $440 per week, a unit $400 per week. A single person (with children) gets $656 per fortnight. They may get about $100 per fortnight rent assistance. As you can see, that is not enough to even pay the rent! If they get some other kind of support, maybe, maybe they can pay the rent. But the there is food, bills, medical expenses, public transport or car costs, school fees ( no books anymore, compulsory laptop), internet costs ( got to have it for school)…….etc
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                                                                                                                  • We weren't able to make communism work properly (fantastic idea) even socialism needs lots of love and care...I'd love basic income to work too...but eveyone is self obsessed and greedy...the planet is going to hell in a hand basket and there are still idiots dumping rubbish in the park...I'm beginning to think we left common sense behind a while back...showing any signs of intelligence is a big ask.....
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                                                                                                                    • Actually, I never HEARD of UBI - till today (11/01/2021). However, I do not reside in an enlightened nation (USA). It is doable in theory (however, capitalism is based on GREED - and GREED makes people very UNREASONABLE)! Would I like to see it happpen in the USA - YES (however, the federal minmum is $7.25 an hour in the year 2021 (with no hint it is ever going to go up) in the USA). Meaning, UBI is NEVER (as in EVER) going to happen in the USA!
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                                                                                                                      • As an outsider, it would seem unlikely to me to happen in the USA until something is worked with the healthcare system, really messy the way it's often tied to the employer there
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                                                                                                                      • BLACK LIVES MATTERMatt M 461986
                                                                                                                        Very good point!
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